Oct 03, 2023 Special City Council

[00:00:09]

GOOD EVENING.

[1. CALL TO ORDER]

ALL MEMBERS ARE PRESENT DECLARATIONS OF CONFLICT OF INTEREST.

[3. DECLARATIONS OF CONFLICT OF INTEREST]

THANK YOU YOUR WORSHIP.

REGARDING ITEM 6.3, MY SON WORKS FOR BLANCHETTE ELECTRIC.

THEREFORE I HAVE AN INDIRECT PECUNIARY INTEREST ON THE AWARDING OF THIS CONTRACT.

OKAY. THANK YOU. COUNCILLOR FLINTOFF.

ANY OTHER DECLARATIONS? COUNCILLOR BULL. THANK YOU.

YOUR WORSHIP REGARDING ITEM 6.1 AND 6.2.

I HAVE AN INDIRECT PECUNIARY PECUNIARY INTEREST IN THAT.

I HAVE A FAMILY MEMBER EMPLOYED BY ONE OF THE BIDDERS.

OKAY. THANK YOU.

COUNCILLOR BULL. DO WE HAVE ANY OTHER DECLARATIONS? GOING ONCE.

GOING TWICE.

OKAY. ITEM FOUR PUBLIC INPUT SESSION THIS EVENING WE HAVE THREE INPUTS ONE BY MR.

[4. PUBLIC INPUT SESSION]

GOOD EVENING. FOR THE RECORD, MY NAME IS STEVE CALVERLEY AND I'M A RESIDENT OF ELLIOT LAKE.

GOOD EVENING, ACTING MAYOR, COUNCILLORS, CITY STAFF AND FELLOW ELLIOT LAKERS.

I'M HERE TO SPEAK TO ITEM 6.4 AND I WILL BE BRIEF.

I WOULD JUST LIKE TO REMIND THE COUNCIL OF THE APPROXIMATELY 700 SIGNATURE PETITION THAT WAS DELIVERED TO YOU A WEEK AGO YESTERDAY.

I WOULD OBSERVE THAT I WAS ONE OF A COUPLE OF DOZEN PEOPLE COLLECTING SIGNATURES, BUT WHEN I WAS GOING DOOR TO DOOR, MY EXPERIENCE WAS THAT AT LEAST 90% OF THE PEOPLE THAT I PRESENTED THE PETITION TO WERE QUITE EAGER TO SIGN IT AND IF WE EXTRAPOLATED THAT EXPERIENCE ACROSS THE CITY, I THINK GIVEN MORE THAN SIX DAYS, YOU WOULD HAVE THOUSANDS OF SIGNATURES.

WHAT THE PETITIONERS ARE REQUESTING IS TO SEE A BIG PICTURE VIEW OF OUR INFRASTRUCTURE ISSUES OF WHICH THE ARENA IS ONLY PART.

SO I'M GOING TO INTERRUPT YOU THERE, MR. CALVERLEY. WE ARE DISCUSSING THE ARENA.

SO PUBLIC INPUT IS TOWARDS THAT, PLEASE, AND SO WITH REGARD TO THE ARENA BEING ONE PART OF WHAT THE REQUEST WAS, I WOULD ASK YOU TO RESPECT.

RESPECT THE PETITION.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MR. CALVERLEY. MR. THOMAS, PLEASE.

EVENING. ACTING MAYOR, MEMBERS OF COUNCIL.

GOOD TO SEE YOU AGAIN. IT'S MIKE THOMAS.

I'M HERE SPECIFICALLY TO SPEAK TO ITEM 6.4.

I'LL PREFACE THAT WITH A STATEMENT THAT IN FAIRNESS TO STAFF AND ANYBODY WHO CONTRIBUTED TO THIS REPORT, I HAVE NOT DISCUSSED IT WITH THEM.

ANYTHING THAT I SAY AFTER THIS IS A PRESUMPTION BASED ON WHAT I READ, THE MATERIAL ON THE AGENDA.

IN ADDITION TO THAT, I'VE REMINDED SOME OF YOU IN THE PAST THAT I'VE WORKED ON INVESTIGATIONS FOR THE PROSECUTION OF AND THE DEFENSE OF MINISTRY OF LABOR INVESTIGATIONS IN A FORMER LIFE, AND IT WAS THROUGH THAT PRISM THAT I ALWAYS REVIEW DOCUMENTATION AND.

I'LL BRING UP A COUPLE OF THOSE POINTS ABOUT.

I THINK IT WAS 101 PAGES.

THE FIRST ITEM THAT CAUGHT MY ATTENTION IS IT IS $330,000 TO BUY US A LITTLE BIT OF TIME TO MAKE SURE A STRUCTURE DOESN'T FALL DOWN, AND IT STATES IN THERE THAT IT'S NOT EVEN SNOW WORTHY.

I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY OF YOU WERE AROUND IN 77 OR 78, BUT WE GOT A LOT OF SNOW, AND THIS YEAR WE'RE PROJECTED TO REPEAT THAT IF THE ALMANAC AND THE WEATHER FOLKS ARE RIGHT.

WE HAVE A UNIQUE EXPERIENCE IN ELLIOT LAKE WITH STEEL STRUCTURES AND WOODEN STRUCTURES.

ONE OF EACH HAVE FAILED.

BOTH OF THOSE STRUCTURES WERE VIEWED BY ENGINEERS AND WE WERE GIVEN THE BEST ASSURANCES THAT IT WOULD WITHSTAND JUST ABOUT ANYTHING.

[00:05:07]

WHAT CAUGHT MY EYE IN THIS ONE AND WHAT I WISH ALL OF YOU WOULD HAVE BEEN GIVEN.

NORMALLY WHEN YOU LOOK AT A STRUCTURAL REVIEW OF THIS TYPE OF BUILDING, INSTEAD OF SHOWING YOU THE INDIVIDUAL ITEMS OF THE TRUSSES OR THE INDIVIDUAL POINTS OF WEAKNESS OR REPARATION, IT'S ABOUT A FIVE MINUTE PROCESS TO DO A 2D RENDER OF A COMPLETE OVERVIEW OF THE ROOF SO THAT YOU COULD SEE THE YELLOWS AND THE REDS.

IT'S NOT HARD TO DO.

I MEAN, YOU KNOW, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN HELPFUL TO HAVE THAT INCLUDED, AND THEN WHAT THAT WOULD HAVE AVAILED YOU.

THE OPPORTUNITY IS TO SEE THE STRUCTURAL WEAKNESS IN A 2D PERSPECTIVE AS OPPOSED TO RELYING ON INDIVIDUAL POINTS OF DATA TO SAY, YEAH, IT'S WEAK HERE, WE CAN FIX THIS, WE COULD DO THAT.

SO THAT INTRIGUES ME TO A LARGE EXTENT BECAUSE IT REALLY BELAYS ITSELF TO THE DECISION AT HAND.

DO WE SPEND THE MONEY NOW TO BUY THE TIME OR DO WE CALL IT A DAY AND TEAR IT DOWN AND FIGURE OUT WHAT TO DO NEXT, KIND OF THE CART BEFORE THE HORSE THING? AND IF YOU DON'T HAVE ALL THE INFORMATION, IT BECOMES A VERY DIFFICULT DECISION TO MAKE.

THE SECOND THING THAT OCCURRED TO ME IS THAT.

WHEN YOU HAVE AN ENGINEER OR TEAM OF ENGINEERS OR A COUPLE OF ENTITIES DECLARE TO YOU THAT AN ENTITY OR A FACILITY IS STRUCTURALLY UNSOUND.

BASICALLY, THEY'RE RED TAGGING IT, AND IF ANYBODY'S WORKED IN THE HEALTH AND SAFETY INDUSTRY, WHEN YOU RED TAG SOMETHING, IT'S FORBIDDEN TO TOUCH IT, TO MOVE IT, TO OPERATE IT, TO DO ANYTHING, AND THEY'VE DONE THAT APPROPRIATELY.

SO MY ISSUE WITH THAT IS WHEN YOU RED TAG A FACILITY.

PART OF THIS PROCESS OF THE TENDER STATES THAT IN ORDER FOR US TO SAVE MONEY, WE'RE GOING TO PUT OUR STAFF IN THERE TO DO SOME OF THE WORK, SOME OF THE GRUNT WORK, SOME OF THE PEELING AWAY OF MATERIALS, SOME OF THE PEELING AWAY OF SOFT ON THE OUTSIDE SO THAT WE WILL SAVE MONEY.

THEY'LL GO IN AND DO THE HARD STUFF JUST TO SHORE IT UP.

MY CAUTION WOULD BE THAT IF ANY OF YOU HAVE EVER SEEN THE LITTLE GREEN BOOK OF THE OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY ACT, IT'S BORING STUFF, BUT IT'S A GOOD READ.

IT'S PERTINENT TO OUR COUNCIL.

I THINK WE RUN INTO A PROBLEM IF WE ASK OUR STAFF TO GO IN AND WORK ON SOMETHING THAT'S BEEN LABELED AS NOT STRUCTURALLY SOUND.

I DON'T KNOW HOW WE SQUARE THAT.

THAT WOULD BE ONE OF MY PRIMARY CONCERNS, AND THAT'S ABOVE AND BEYOND THE DECISION YOU'RE BEING ASKED TO CONSIDER, WHICH IS WHAT IS THE COST OF WHAT WE'RE DOING? WHAT ARE WE GOING TO GET FOR IT? HOW MUCH TIME IS IT GOING TO BUY US? AND YOU KNOW, IN MY WHOLE LIFE I KNOW I'M GETTING A LITTLE OLDER NOW.

I'VE NEVER HEARD OF A BUILDING MONITORING SYSTEM, AND MY MY ISSUE WITH THAT IS WHY DO WE NEED ELECTRONIC DEVICE TO TELL US TWO SECONDS BEFORE SOMETHING HAPPENS IF THEY'RE GOING TO PUT THAT IN THERE IN THIS FACILITY? I THINK IT'S A COLOSSAL WASTE.

WE ALREADY KNOW WHAT THE CONDITION OF THE FACILITY IS.

SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT ELSE TO TELL YOU THAT IS NOT INFLAMMATORY.

I'M TRYING TO BE RESPECTFUL.

I'M TRYING TO BE HELPFUL.

THERE'S 20 QUESTIONS MORE THAT I COULD ASK IF I WERE IN YOUR SHOES, BUT I CANNOT, AND I HAVE NOT DISCUSSED IT WITH ANY OF YOU ON PURPOSE FOR THAT EFFECT, BUT WHAT I IMPLORE YOU TO DO IN YOUR CAPACITY AS THE DECISION MAKERS OF THIS MUNICIPALITY IS TO REJECT THIS PROPOSAL.

WE'VE DONE IT BEFORE.

ONE MEMBER OF COUNCIL IS AWARE OF THE COST OF THAT PERSONALLY, AND TO THROW $330,000 AT AN ISSUE THAT THEY'RE GOING TO COME BACK AND TELL US IS GOING TO BE ANOTHER MILLION TO A MILLION AND A HALF TO MAKE IT SNOW WORTHY OR FIT FOR HABITATION.

I THINK IT'S A COLOSSAL WASTE OF RESOURCES, AND I THINK WE CAN DO BETTER THAN THAT, AND I THINK IT'S TIME WE DO.

EVERY COMMUNITY IN THE NORTH, THE TWO PRIMARY FACILITIES OF EVERY PLACE WE'VE EVER VISITED SINCE WE'VE BEEN UP HERE IS AN ARENA AND A POOL, AND I DON'T ENVY YOUR CHOICE OR YOUR DECISIONS.

I APPRECIATE THE WORK THAT WENT INVOLVED IN THIS, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, I THINK IT'S A BAD PROPOSAL, A BAD INVESTMENT, AND I URGE YOU TO REJECT IT.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

OKAY. THANK YOU FOR YOUR INPUT, MR. THOMAS. SO THE WRITTEN LETTER IS FROM MICHAEL [INAUDIBLE], WHO IS A RESIDENT OF ELLIOT LAKE.

IT IS TIME FOR ELLIOT LAKE COUNCIL TO GET SERIOUS AND LOOK AT A VOTE ON A PROPERTY TAX SPECIAL LEVY TO INVEST PROPERLY IN A NEW ARENA AND RECREATION CENTER.

[00:10:02]

A SMALL LEVY USED IN MANY COMMUNITIES FOR PROPER MODERN FACILITY DESIGNED FOR ALL RESIDENTS USE WOULD LIKELY GO UNCHALLENGED.

THE CITY SHOULD LOOK TO ISSUE MUNICIPAL BONDS FOR FUNDING A NEW CENTER AS WELL.

RECREATION CENTER FEES WOULD BE USED FOR OPERATION EXPENSES AND BOND REPAYMENTS.

THESE ACTIONS, ALONG WITH PROVIDING A PROPER DESIGN WITHIN MODERN ESG AND CLIMATE ACTION STANDARDS, WOULD ALSO SHOW BOTH FEDERAL AND PROVINCIAL GOVERNMENTS. ELLIOT LAKE IS SERIOUS ABOUT ITS FUTURE WHEN APPLYING FOR GRANTS RIGHT NOW.

ELLIOT LAKE IS NOT A SERIOUS CITY, WASTING MILLIONS ON PATCHWORK AND BAND-AIDS.

I'VE HAD THE PLEASURE OF LIVING IN MULTIPLE CITIES ACROSS NORTH AMERICA.

I HAVE LIVED IN TOWNS WITH LESS PEOPLE THAN ELLIOT LAKE THAT WERE ABLE TO BUILD A NEW ARENA AND RECREATION CENTER WITH A SPECIAL LEVY.

I MOVED MY FAMILY TO ELLIOT LAKE SEVEN YEARS AGO IN HOPES OF A FOREVER HOME FOR MY FAMILY.

WITHOUT A NEW ARENA AND RECREATION CENTER, MY FAMILY HAS NO FUTURE IN THIS CITY.

THANK YOU. MICHAEL [INAUDIBLE].

OKAY. ITEM FIVE PUBLIC PRESENTATIONS.

THERE ARE NONE.

[6.1 Report from the Special Projects Manager]

6.1 REPORT FROM THE SPECIAL PROJECTS MANAGER REGARDING AWARD TENDER FOR A&B GRAVEL.

I HAVE A MOTION THAT THE REPORT OF THE SPECIAL PROJECTS MANAGER BE RECEIVED AND THAT CONTRACT 2023-08 FOR THE SCREENING AND STOCKPILING OF GRANULAR A& B GRAVEL IN THE AMOUNT OF $98,310 TAXES INCLUDED BE AWARDED TO 1000062858. ONTARIO LIMITED OPERATING AS WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING OF ELLIOT LAKE AND THAT THE FUNDS BE TAKEN FROM THE 2023 OPERATIONS BUDGET ROADS AND MAINTENANCE AND THAT THE APPROPRIATE BYLAW BE ENACTED TO AFFECT THIS DECISION.

MAY I HAVE A MOVER? COUNCILLOR MANN.

SECONDED. COUNCILLOR FLINTOFF.

SPECIAL PROJECTS IS SCOTT.

GO AHEAD. THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.

YES, SIR. AS YOU HAD SAID, WE RECOMMEND THAT THE REPORT BE RECEIVED AND THAT A CONTRACT BE AWARDED TO WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING FOR $98,000 FOR GRANULAR A AND B GRAVEL.

WE RELEASED A REQUEST FOR TENDER ON THE BIDS AND TENDER SYSTEM ON THE 21ST OF SEPTEMBER THAT TENDER WAS FOR BIDS FOR THE SUPPLY OF 3000M³ OF B GRAVEL AND 500M³ OF GRAVEL.

THE BIDS CLOSED ON THE 28TH OF SEPTEMBER, AND THE CITY RECEIVED TWO BIDS ONE FROM WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING AND THE SECOND FROM EXCUSE ME, AND THE SECOND FROM BEAMISH.

THE BIDS WERE IN THE AMOUNTS OF.

MR. FARQUHAR QUOTED $23 PER CUBIC METER FOR GRAVEL, $36 FOR PER CUBIC METER FOR THE GRAVEL FOR A TOTAL OF, AS YOU SAID, 98,000 AND BEAMISH QUOTED SLIGHTLY HIGHER, $24 PER CUBIC METER FOR THE B GRAVEL AND $44.80 FOR THE A GRAVEL.

HE CAME IN AT $106,841.50.

IT IS RECOMMENDED THAT THE TENDER BE AWARDED TO WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING FOR $98,310 TAXES INCLUDED.

THE FUNDING WILL COME OUT OF THE ROAD MAINTENANCE SERVICE CONTRACT THAT WAS INCLUDED IN THE 2023 BUDGET, AND RIGHT NOW WE SIT AT $22,009 FOR GRAVEL.

TYPICALLY, THE CITY DOES PURCHASE GRAVEL ON A STOCKPILING OR INVENTORY BASIS BY KEEPING AN INVENTORY AN INVENTORY ON HAND.

IT HELPS US TO REDUCE THE COST AND LEAD TIME.

WITH RESPECT TO THE OTHER PROJECTS THAT WE HAVE ON THE GO.

SO AGAIN, YOUR HONOR, YOUR WORSHIP, IT IS RECOMMENDED THAT THIS TENDER BE SUBMITTED BY 100062858, OPERATING AS WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING AND THE AMOUNT OF $98,310 HST INCLUDED FOR THE SCREENING AND STOCKPILING OF GRANULAR A AND B GRAVEL BE ACCEPTED. OKAY.

[00:15:02]

DO WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? COUNCILLOR MORRISSETTE. THROUGH YOU, MR. CHAIR. WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A AND B, AND DO WE NEED BOTH OF THEM, OR CAN WE JUST WORK WITH ONE? THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

WELL, IT'S A DIFFERENT GRANULE SIZE, AND THEY'RE USED FOR DIFFERENT PURPOSES.

SO TYPICALLY, OUR GRAVEL IS USED FOR BACKFILLING OUR WATER MAIN BREAKS AND DIFFERENT ROADWORKS THAT WE HAVE, AND A GRAVEL IS COMMONLY KNOWN AND, WELL, IT DEPENDS ON WHAT PIT IT'S BEING DRAWN FROM, BUT IT'S MORE AKIN TO SAND THAN THAN B GRAVEL, WHICH HAS MORE STONES IN IT. OKAY.

JUST A QUICK QUESTION. IS THERE A DIFFERENCE IN QUALITY BETWEEN THE COMPANIES? IS THAT THE DIFFERENCE IN THEIR PRICE OR IS IT A GRAVEL IS THE SAME ALL ACROSS EVERYWHERE? THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU, YOU'VE TOUCHED ON A VERY SENSITIVE TOPIC AMONGST SOME CIRCLES.

SO I'VE NEVER EXPERIENCED THIS BEFORE LIVING IN ELLIOT LAKE, BUT IF YOU ASK PEOPLE IN THIS TOWN, YES, THERE'S A HUGE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN DIFFERENT PITS AND WHERE THEY DRAW FROM, BECAUSE THERE IS SOME VARIETY IN THE NATURAL PRODUCT THAT WE'RE DRAWING FROM THE DIFFERENT PITS.

IN MY TIME IN SOUTHERN ONTARIO, THAT WAS NEVER REALLY A CONSIDERATION THAT WE HAD BECAUSE TRUCKING MOVED MATERIALS AROUND SO MUCH.

SO IT'S A BIT OF A CULTURAL UNIQUE.

ITEM HERE, BUT IN GENERAL KNOW THAT WE'VE WE SPECIFIED THE TENDERS TO MEET.

CERTAIN SPECIFICATIONS THAT ALL OF THESE PITS MEET AND THE BIDDERS RESPONDED APPROPRIATELY, AND THE DIFFERENCE IN PRICE, I WOULD PRESUME, WOULD BE PRIMARILY DUE TO THE DISTANCE AWAY OF THE DIFFERENT PITS DRAWN THAT THE PROVIDERS ARE DRAWING FROM THE TRUCKING IS A BIG PART OF THIS PRICE.

OKAY. THANK YOU, MR. GOULDING.

COUNCILLOR FLINTOFF THANK YOU.

WORSHIP THROUGH YOU TO MR. GOULDING. SO YOU'RE SAYING THIS IS A STOCKPILE FOR THE PIT.

SO HOW OFTEN DO WE DO THIS? IS THIS LIKE THEY CHECK IT ONCE A YEAR? BECAUSE THIS REALLY HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH OUR WINTER MAINTENANCE.

THIS IS JUST A.

THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

I WOULDN'T SAY THAT IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH OUR WINTER MAINTENANCE PER SE.

I MEAN, IF YOU THINK OF WINTER MAINTENANCE IN TERMS OF OF OUR SNOW REMOVAL AND OUR APPLYING SAND TO THE ROADS, YES, YOU'RE CORRECT.

IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THAT, BUT A GOOD PORTION OF OUR WATER MAIN BREAKS OCCUR THROUGH THE WINTER AND THE GRAVEL HAPPENS TO BE USED QUITE EXTENSIVELY IN THE RESTORATION OF THAT.

OF THOSE SITES, AND I'M SORRY, I FORGOT WHAT YOUR ACTUAL SECOND QUESTION WAS.

YOU HAD TWO. SO WHAT I'M SAYING IS WE'RE GOING TO FILL IT UP, AND THEN ROUGHLY HOW LONG DOES IT LAST? SORRY, THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP, UNDERSTANDABLY, THIS IS THE FIRST TIME I'VE SEEN THIS BULK PURCHASE HAPPEN.

SO I WOULD PRESUME THAT IT'S EVERY LIKE MULTIPLE PERIOD OF YEARS BECAUSE IT'S EVERY 2 TO 3 YEARS IS WHAT COUNCILLOR MANN IS, IS MOTIONING TO ME, WHICH WOULD MAKE SENSE GIVEN THE RECENT INCREASE IN PRICES AND OUR BUDGETED AMOUNT.

WE DO AN INVENTORY OF THIS MATERIAL EVERY YEAR TO FIGURE OUT WHAT OUR ANNUAL USAGE OF IT WOULD BE.

SO BASED ON THIS MOST RECENT TENDER RESULT, WE WOULD PROBABLY SEE OUR BUDGET INCREASE A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE THE MATERIAL IS WORTH MORE THAN IT WAS 2 OR 3 YEARS AGO BUT YEAH, SO THE $22,000 AMOUNT IS REPRESENTATIVE OF WHAT OUR ACTUAL USES.

AFTER STOCKPILING, WE RECONCILE THAT BY DOING INVENTORY EVERY YEAR.

OKAY. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? OKAY, SO LET'S HAVE A VOTE.

ALL IN FAVOR? NONE ARE OPPOSED.

THAT IS CARRIED.

[6.2 Report from the Special Projects Manager]

I HAVE A MOTION THAT THE REPORT OF THE SPECIAL PROJECTS MANAGER BE RECEIVED AND THAT CONTRACT 2023-05 FOR THE SCREENING AND STOCKPILING OF WINTER SAND IN THE AMOUNT OF $127,464 HST INCLUDED BE AWARDED TO 1000062858 ONTARIO LIMITED OPERATING AS WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING AND THAT THE FUNDS BE TAKEN FROM THE 2023 OPERATIONS BUDGET ROADS MAINTENANCE AND THAT THE APPROPRIATE BYLAW BE ENACTED TO AFFECT THIS DECISION.

WE HAVE A MOVER COUNCILLOR SEIDEL SECONDED COUNCILLOR MORRISSETTE.

[00:20:02]

THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP, THIS WAS ANOTHER INVITE TO TENDER THAT WE POSTED ON BIDS AND TENDER.

WE POSTED THIS ONE ON THE 12TH OF SEPTEMBER.

IT WAS FOR 3000M³ OF WINTER.

SAND REQUESTED ON THE SPECS INCLUDED IN THE SCOPE OF WORK THAT WAS ATTACHED TO THE TENDER.

THE CONTRACT PROVIDES FOR THE SCREENING AND STOCKPILING OF WINTER SAND AT THE PUBLIC WORKS YARD LOCATED ON HIGHWAY 108 IN THE VICINITY OF ESTEN DRIVE NORTH. THE ACQUISITION AND STOCKPILING OF WINTER SAND IS CONDUCTED ANNUALLY PRIOR TO THE ONSET OF WINTER.

THE TENDER WAS DOWNLOADED BY FIVE COMPANIES AND WE RECEIVED TWO BIDS ONE FROM OPERATING AS WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING AND THE SECOND FROM BEAMISH CONSTRUCTION.

THE PRICING FOR THE WINTER SAND FROM FARQUHAR TRUCKING WAS $37.97 PER CUBIC METER BY 3000M³ GAVE US A VALUE OF 112,800 TAXES NOT INCLUDED.

BEAMISH CONSTRUCTION QUOTED A UNIT PRICE OF $38.97 PER CUBIC METER, AND FOR THAT 3000 CUBIC METER REQUIREMENT, IT CAME UP TO $116,910 TAXES EXTRA.

I'M JUST GOING TO REFER TO MY NOTES.

I JUST LIKE TO NOTE THAT THE PRICING FOR WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING WAS THE SAME UNIT PRICE THAT THEY PROVIDED LAST YEAR.

NO IRREGULARITIES WERE NOTED DURING THE TENDER REVIEW PROCESS AND IT IS RECOMMENDED THAT THE TENDER SUBMITTED BY WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING IN THE AMOUNT OF $127,464.

THAT INCLUDES TAXES FOR THE SCREENING AND STOCKPILING OF WINTER SAND BE ACCEPTED.

THANK YOU, MR. [INAUDIBLE].

ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS HERE? COUNCILLOR MANN.

THANK YOU. WORSHIP THROUGH YOU.

JUST A COMMENT AND THEN A QUESTION, I THINK, TO MR. GOULDING. INTERESTING TO SEE THAT THE TENDER WAS ACTUALLY DOWNLOADED BY A COUPLE OF OTHER COMPANIES, WHICH IS A LITTLE UNUSUAL BECAUSE WE DON'T TYPICALLY HAVE THAT KIND OF INTEREST FROM AROUND THE PROVINCE AND OTHER COMPANIES, WHICH I'M ASSUMING ARE OPERATING IN THE AREA AS WELL, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE LISTED AS ALBERTA, AND THE ONLY OTHER QUESTION IS WHAT TYPE OF INVENTORY LEVELS DO WE HAVE FROM LAST YEAR? I ASK TYPICALLY THIS TO ENSURE THAT WE'RE ACTUALLY GETTING ENOUGH SAND.

NOW, I KNOW THAT'S ALWAYS A BIT OF AN ESTIMATE, BUT BASED ON SOME COMMENTS WE HEARD EARLIER, IF WE'RE EXPECTING THAT KIND OF WINTER, ARE WE GOING TO ORDER SUFFICIENT? THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP. MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT WE WERE QUITE LOW AND THAT'S WHY WE NEEDED TO REPLENISH.

IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE CAN MONITOR THIS YEAR.

IT'S ALSO SOMETHING THAT WE SPOKE ABOUT AT THE LAST PUBLIC SERVICES MEETING, HOW I HAVE AN APPETITE TO DO SOME MORE CONSIDERED INVENTORY CONTROL ON THIS MATERIAL, AND THAT'S A BIT OF A DELICATE OPERATION BECAUSE I THINK THERE'S WISDOM IN THE AMOUNT OF MATERIAL THAT WE SPREAD IN THE MUNICIPALITY.

IT'S JUST I'D LIKE TO MEASURE IT SO THAT WE CAN BETTER UNDERSTAND IT.

THANK YOU. COUNCILLOR MORRISSETTE.

THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

ONE THING I COULD NEVER UNDERSTAND IS WHY DO THEY HAVE A PLOW COME AROUND WITH THE SAND, PUT IT DOWN AND THERE'S A PLOW THAT COMES RIGHT BEHIND IT AND PLOWS THE ROAD AND TAKES THE SAND OFF.

IS THERE A LOGIC WITH THAT? BECAUSE I DON'T DON'T UNDERSTAND THE WHOLE CONCEPT THERE.

THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

I DON'T KNOW THAT I WANT TO DANCE THROUGH AN ANSWER ON THAT.

I DON'T KNOW THAT WE ACTUALLY DO THAT.

SO I THINK THAT WOULD BE MY FIRST QUESTION.

IF IT HAPPENS FROM TIME TO TIME, I'D BE INTERESTED TO KNOW WHY AS WELL.

I JUST LOOK FOR SUPPORT FROM OUR OPERATIONS MANAGER OR ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, AND I THINK WE'RE COMING UP SHORT FOR AN ANSWER THERE, SO I DON'T THINK I'D LIKE TO IMPROVISE ONE NOW FOR YOU. FOLLOW UP.

I KNOW DOWN SOUTH ALSO THEY USED, I THINK IT'S BEET JUICES OR TO HELP WITH THE ROAD.

YES. IS THAT SOMETHING YOU GUYS LOOK AT? IS IT SOMETHING THAT COULD WORK HERE AND IS IT CHEAPER THAN WHAT WE'RE DOING RIGHT NOW? THANK THANK YOU.

THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP. YES.

THERE'S A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT INTERESTING SOLUTIONS THAT ARE USED ELSEWHERE IN THE COUNTRY, ACTUALLY, AND I DID NOTE SOME OF THEM AT THE GOOD ROADS CONFERENCE BEING MARKETED

[00:25:06]

THEY MOST OF THOSE KINDS OF SOLUTIONS SEEM TO BE EFFECTIVE UP IN AND AROUND MINUS TEN AND THEN LOSE THEIR EFFECTIVENESS, AND IF WE COULD LEVERAGE THAT, THAT WOULD BE GREAT, BUT THE IDEA OF SPINNING UP EXTRA EQUIPMENT AND INFRASTRUCTURE IN ORDER TO DEAL WITH A SECONDARY MATERIAL, I CAN'T SEE THAT THERE LIKELY BE A BUSINESS CASE FOR FOR DOING THAT HERE BECAUSE OF OUR COLDER TEMPERATURES.

OKAY. THANK YOU. COUNCILLOR MORRISSETTE.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? OKAY. SEEING NONE. LET'S HAVE A VOTE.

ALL IN FAVOR? OKAY. NONE ARE OPPOSED.

THAT'S CARRIED, AND THEN ITEM 6.3 REPORT FROM THE SPECIAL PROJECTS MANAGER REGARDING LAKEVIEW ROAD LIFT

[6.3 Report from the Special Projects Manager]

WE HAVE A MOVER COUNCILLOR BULL SECONDED.

COUNCILLOR MANN.

MR. [INAUDIBLE].

THANK YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

THE LAKEVIEW ROAD LIFT STATION REBUILD PROJECT INVOLVES UPGRADING THE EQUIPMENT SO THAT THE STATION CAN BE POWERED BY AN UNINTERRUPTED POWER SOURCE, AN ELECTRICAL POWER SOURCE, PRESENT DURING A LOSS OF HYDRO ONE POWER.

THE PUMPS AT THE LAKEVIEW LIFT STATION OPERATE ON PROPANE AS PART OF THE REBUILD PROJECT.

THE CITY WOULD REMOVE THE PROPANE TANK AND THE PROPANE POWERED PUMPS.

THE CITY WOULD THEN FIX AND LOCATION A BACKUP GENERATOR AND INSTALL THE NEW TOTALLY ELECTRIC POWERED PUMPS.

THE CONTRACTOR BEI, WOULD THEN PROVIDE ALL THE LABOR REQUIRED TO INSTALL THE MAIN SERVICE PANEL AND MAKE ALL THE ELECTRICAL CONNECTIONS BETWEEN THE HYDRO ONE MAIN AND THE MAIN TO THE MAIN SERVICE PANEL AS WELL.

BLANCHETTE ELECTRICAL, INC.

WOULD MAKE THE ELECTRICAL CONNECTIONS BETWEEN THE MAIN SERVICE PANEL, THE BACKUP GENERATOR AND THE PUMPS.

THE MAIN SERVICE PANEL.

THE PUMPS AND THE BACKUP GENERATOR HAVE BEEN SUPPLIED FROM INVENTORY OF NEW AND REFURBISHED CITY EQUIPMENT.

THE TENDER INCLUDED A SCOPE OF WORK, AND ALL THE ASSOCIATED DOCUMENTS WERE PREPARED BY THE CITY AND A COPY IS AVAILABLE FOR THE COUNCIL'S REVIEW. THE CITY UTILIZED THE NEGOTIATING METHOD IS DEFINED IN OUR PURCHASING BYLAW NUMBER 14-48, SECTION EIGHT, PARAGRAPH ONE D, A NONCOMPETITIVE INVITATION TO TENDER FOR THE LAKEVIEW LIFT STATION INSTALL AN ELECTRICAL CONNECTION.

IT WAS PROVIDED TO BE BLANCHETTE ELECTRICAL ON THE 18TH OF AUGUST, AND BLANCHETTE RETURNED THE BID ON THE 31ST OF AUGUST.

WE USED THIS NON INVITATION TO TENDER FOR THIS PROJECT DUE TO THE ANTICIPATED HIGH DEGREE OF COORDINATION THAT WOULD BE REQUIRED BETWEEN THE [INAUDIBLE] PLANT STAFF AND THE VENDOR.

LOGISTICALLY, THIS REQUIRES A LOCAL VENDOR THAT IS QUALIFIED FOR THIS TYPE OF WORK AND THAT IS AVAILABLE FOR CALL OUT ON SHORT NOTICE.

THE BLANCHETTE ELECTRICAL SUBMISSION WAS OPENED BY THE CITY AT 2 P.M.

ON THE 31ST OF AUGUST THURSDAY, AND THE EVALUATION WAS COMPLETED ON THE SAME DAY.

BEI WAS FOUND TO BE COMPLIANT WITH ALL REQUIREMENTS.

THE LAKEVIEW LIFT STATION REBUILD PROJECT IS IDENTIFIED IN THE APPROVED 2023 CAPITAL WATER WASTEWATER BUDGET AND THE BUDGET HAS AN ALLOCATION OF $223,160.

THE WASTEWATER RESERVE AS OF 1ST JANUARY HAD AN OPENING BALANCE OF $7.8 MILLION.

THE APPROVE THE APPROVAL OF THE BEI CONTRACT WITH THE VALUE OF $47,227 HST INCLUDED IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE INVENTORY AND REFURBISHED EQUIPMENTS WILL SEE THE PROJECT COMPLETED WITH A CAPITAL BUDGET SAVINGS OF $175,000.

[00:30:01]

FURTHER RECOMMENDS IT IS RECOMMENDED THAT THE CONTRACT BE AWARDED TO BEI IN THE AMOUNT OF $41,794.

TAX NOT INCLUDED FOR THE SERVICES AS DETAILED IN THE INVITATION TO TENDER AND THE RESULTANT CONTRACT.

THANK YOU, MR. [INAUDIBLE].

ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? COUNCILLOR MANN. THANK YOU, YOUR WORSHIP THROUGH YOU TO MR. [INAUDIBLE]. HOW OLD IS THE EXISTING PROPANE POWER SOURCE? I'M SORRY. SAY THAT AGAIN. THE AGE OF THE CURRENT POWER SOURCE.

I'M GOING TO.

40 YEARS.

OKAY. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? COUNCILLOR BULL THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP, I GUESS TO MR. [INAUDIBLE] OR MR. GOULDING, THERE WAS NO OTHER CONTRACTORS IN TOWN.

THAT WHICH PART OF THE OPERATION? WAS THAT THEY'RE THE ONLY ONES THAT ABLE ABLE TO DO.

DID YOU GET THAT? [INAUDIBLE] I'M WITH YOU THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

SO MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT OPERATION STAFF APPROACHED A NUMBER OF VENDORS TO TRY AND GET THIS DONE, AND THIS WAS THE ONE VENDOR THAT WAS OPEN TO DOING THIS SORT OF WORK.

IT'S MORE AN INDUSTRIAL INSTALLATION THAT SUITS THIS THIS OUTFIT.

OKAY. THANK YOU. OKAY.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? OKAY, LET'S HAVE A VOTE.

ALL IN FAVOR.

NONE ARE OPPOSED. THAT IS CARRIED.

SO 6.4 REPORT FROM THE ACTING DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC WORKS REGARDING CENTENNIAL ARENA WOOD STRUCTURE MITIGATION EFFORTS.

[6.4 Report from the Acting Director of Public Works]

MAY I HAVE A MOVER? I'LL MOVE FOR DISCUSSION.

I'LL MOVE FOR DISCUSSION.

SECONDER FOR THAT.

COUNCILLOR BULL.

MR. GOULDING, PLEASE.

THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

SO A LOT TO UNPACK HERE.

WE HAD AN INSPECTION DONE OF THE CENTENNIAL ARENA BY WOOD RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT ON SEPTEMBER 11TH OF THIS YEAR, AND THEY WERE. SCHEDULED TO ATTEND FOR TWO DAYS, AND DURING THE FIRST DAY WE FOUND ENOUGH AREAS THAT WERE OF CONCERN THAT IT BECAME EVIDENT THAT WE NEEDED TO HAVE A LOT BETTER LOOK AT WHAT WAS GOING ON WITH THE STRUCTURE. SO FROM A HIGH LEVEL, THAT KIND OF CONTEXTUALIZES THIS THIS REPORT.

SO AFTER THEIR INSPECTION ON SEPTEMBER 11TH, THEY WENT AWAY AND COMPILED THE DATA THAT THEY WERE ABLE TO COLLECT DURING THEIR ONE DAY INSPECTION AND PROVIDED US WITH THE REPORT THAT YOU FIND ATTACHED TO MY REPORT IN THE AGENDA, AND IT DETAILS A NUMBER OF AREAS THAT ARE OF CONCERN STRUCTURALLY IN THE FACILITY AND I

[00:35:05]

I MEAN, THAT'S THE WHOLE IDEA.

WE KNOW THAT WE HAVE TO HAVE A BETTER LOOK AT THIS IN ORDER TO HAVE A FULL OPINION OF HOW WE COULD GO ABOUT RESTORING THIS OR WHETHER IT'S WORTH ACTUALLY DOING THAT OR NOT.

ALL INDICATIONS AT THIS POINT FROM NOT ONLY WOOD RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT, BUT OTHER PROFESSIONALS THAT I'VE BEEN CONSULTING WITH ARE THAT THIS IS A RESTORABLE FACILITY AND IT'S WORTH AT LEAST GATHERING THE INFORMATION TO MAKE THAT DETERMINATION BEFORE WE ESSENTIALLY [INAUDIBLE] IT TO BEING DECOMMISSIONED AND DEMOLISHED.

SOME GOOD QUESTIONS RAISED IN THE PUBLIC INPUT.

WHY IS THIS ONLY SHORING QUOTES FOR NON WINTER LOADING? WELL, THE SIMPLE ANSWER IS THAT THERE HASN'T BEEN THE FULL CANVASS YET TO DETERMINE WHAT SHORING WOULD BE REQUIRED TO SUPPORT WINTER LOADING BASED ON. WE'RE LOOKING FOR DIRECTION FROM WOOD RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT TO ON OCCUPANCY SO THAT WE CAN DO WORK, AND THEY THEY MADE IT CLEAR THAT THEY WOULD BE WILLING TO PROVIDE THAT LETTER ON CERTAIN CONDITIONS, AND THOSE CONDITIONS ARE REAL TIME MONITORING OF THE STRUCTURE SO THAT THEY HAVE SOME COMFORT THAT THEIR CALCULATIONS ARE.

SOUND AND SO AND PUTTING SOME IMMEDIATE SHORING IN PLACE THAT THEY KNOW WILL WORK WITHOUT ANY SNOW LOAD BASED ON THE INFORMATION THAT THEY'VE BEEN ABLE TO COLLECT, AND WITH THAT IN PLACE, THEY COULD GO AND REVIEW THE.

THE ENTIRETY OF THE WOOD STRUCTURE COMPLETELY WITH FINISHES REMOVED SO THAT THEY CAN SEE EVERY PIECE OF THE WOODEN STRUCTURE AND THEN DESIGN EITHER ASSURING PLAN TO PUT IN PLACE TO GET US THROUGH WINTER IF THAT'S THE MOST PRACTICAL WAY FORWARD.

OR THEY COULD DESIGN PROGRESSIVE REPAIRS AS THEY WENT THROUGH, AND FRANKLY, I THINK WE'RE OPEN TO CONSIDERING EITHER, BUT TO GET TO THE POINT WHERE WE CAN HAVE AN OPINION ON WHAT EITHER WOULD COST, WE KIND OF NEED TO GET THROUGH THIS FIRST PHASE TO HAVE A BETTER LOOK AT THE BUILDING.

SEEING A BUNCH OF MAYBE CONFUSED FACES.

SO I THINK WE COULD GO A LOT OF WAYS WITH THIS DISCUSSION.

MAYBE I'LL CUT OFF THERE AND INVITE PEOPLE TO ASK QUESTIONS THAT I CAN ANSWER.

OKAY. THANK YOU, MR. GOULDING. QUESTIONS? WHO WOULD LIKE TO START? COUNCILLOR SEIDEL.

THANK YOU. YOUR WORSHIP THROUGH YOU.

SO YOU'RE SAYING THAT WE HAVE TO PUT THIS MONITORING INTO PLACE BEFORE WE WILL BE ALLOWED TO GO IN TO SHORE UP THE BUILDING AS A SAFETY PRECAUTION? THANK YOU.

THROUGH YOUR WORSHIP, WE HAVE A CHICKEN AND THE EGG PROBLEM WITH THE BUILDING.

WE NEED TO DO WORK ON THE BUILDING, AND WE KNOW THAT IT'S GOT STRUCTURAL ISSUES.

SO THE IDEA IS TO COORDINATE WITH THE ENGINEERS ON SITE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE UNDER THEIR GUIDANCE TO AFFECT REPAIRS IN A WAY THAT IS AS SAFE AS POSSIBLE IN ORDER TO MAKE THE SITE PROGRESSIVELY SAFER AS WE WORK OUR WAY THROUGH IT, AND I DON'T THINK THAT THERE'S ANY OTHER WAY TO DO IT UNLESS WE HAD THAT SPECIALTY ADVICE IN PLACE.

OKAY. FOLLOW UP.

SO IN YOUR REPORT, YOU SAID THAT THE YOU'RE HOPING TO GET WRD TO MOBILIZE WITHIN THREE WEEKS.

SO THAT'S TO COME IN AND DO THE MONITORING, BUT THEY THEY WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SIT AROUND AND WATCH WHILE WE REMOVE THE INTERIOR OF THAT BUILDING.

CORRECT. THROUGH THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

SO WE'RE STILL TRYING TO WORK OUT THE LOGISTICS ON THAT TIMING.

IT COULD GO ONE OF TWO WAYS.

ONE, IT'S APPROXIMATELY TEN HOURS FOR THEM TO PUT THE MONITORING IN PLACE IS WHAT THEY'RE ESTIMATING.

AFTER THAT, I'M HOPING THAT THEIR TIMING AND LOGISTICS WORKS OUT SO THAT THEY CAN JUST MOBILIZE ONCE AND PROGRESSIVELY WORK THROUGH.

SO ONCE WE HAVE SHORING INSTALLED AND MONITORING IN PLACE UNDER THEIR GUIDANCE, THEN WE WOULD CONTINUE ON TO WORK OUR WAY STRAIGHT THROUGH WITH THEM JUST MOBILIZING ONCE, AND THAT'S WHAT I'M UNDERSTANDING THAT THEY'RE ABLE TO DO, BUT IT'S CONTINGENT UPON WHAT WE SEE ON SITE AS THEY GO THROUGH THE INSPECTION.

[00:40:02]

OKAY. THANK YOU. LET'S JUST START WITH THE MONITORING SYSTEM AND CAN YOU EXPLAIN THAT FURTHER? IT TAKES TEN HOURS TO PLACE.

WHAT DOES THE MONITORING SYSTEM PROVIDE US? THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU.

SO IN A VERY PRACTICAL SENSE, IT PROVIDES US WITH A CONSULTANT THAT'S WILLING TO ADVISE US ON THE BASIS ON WHICH WE CAN OCCUPY A BUILDING.

THAT'S WHAT IT MEANS TO US IN THE END.

THAT'S THE FEATURE AND BENEFIT THAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR, BUT IN TERMS OF WHAT THE DEVICE CAN ACTUALLY DO, IT SENSES MOVEMENT IN THE STRUCTURE, AND OVER A CERTAIN THRESHOLD, IT WILL SEND A SIGNAL OUT TO ALERT THE MONITORING PERSONNEL AT WRD THAT THERE'S MOVEMENT IN THE STRUCTURE AND THEN THEY WOULD ADVISE TO ACCORDINGLY BASED ON WHAT THEY SEE WITH THE WITH THE MONITORS, EITHER TO GET OUT OF THE BUILDING OR JUST TO ADVISE US THAT THERE MIGHT BE AN ISSUE IN ONE PARTICULAR PLACE, OR THEY CAN PROVIDE REAL TIME CONSULTANCY BASED ON FEEDBACK THAT THEY CAN SEE WITH THESE DEVICES, AND HAVE THEY USED THIS METHOD IN PREVIOUS BUILDINGS? THIS GUY SEEMS TO BE THE SPECIALIST AND HAS BEEN ALL OVER, AND HAS ANYTHING GONE WRONG WITH THIS MONITORING SYSTEM THAT YOU KNOW OF? THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU.

SO NOT TO MY I DON'T KNOW OF AN EVENT WHERE THESE MONITORS HAVE GONE WRONG.

IS IT CONCEIVABLE THAT THEY WOULD? SURE. JUST LIKE ANY OTHER DEVICE.

ARE THEY INSTALLED WIDELY? YES, ACTUALLY, IT SEEMS LIKE THESE.

DEVICES ARE USED EXTENSIVELY BY THIS CONSULTANCY FIRM, AND IN FACT, I BELIEVE THAT THIS SOLUTION WAS OFFERED TO US PREVIOUSLY AT THE ARENA BY WRD, AND I DON'T KNOW HOW FORMAL THAT PROPOSAL WAS AT THE TIME, BUT IN DISCUSSION WITH [INAUDIBLE] WITH WRD INDICATES THAT THIS WAS FLOATED AS A SOLUTION TO SOME OF OUR ISSUES LAST TIME.

AS YOU MENTIONED, THEY DO WORK ALL OVER THE WORLD ON WOOD STRUCTURES.

A LOT OF THEM ARE BRIDGES.

THE PROPOSAL THAT THEY PROVIDED SHOWED A LOT OF BRIDGE INSTALLS OF THESE MONITORING DEVICES WHERE THEY'RE JUST USED PERPETUALLY.

THAT'S NOT THE INTENT WITH THIS INSTALLATION.

WE'RE LOOKING TO HAVE IT FOR A WHILE UNTIL WE CAN STABILIZE THE STRUCTURE AND THEN THERE WOULDN'T BE A USE FOR THEM THEREAFTER.

EXCUSE ME, SIR.

WOULD IT BE OUT OF ORDER IF I ASKED THE SPEAKER TO TURN HIS MIC UP A LITTLE BIT OR TO SPEAK MORE DIRECTLY INTO IT.

MY OLD EARS ARE NOT HEARING WHAT HE'S SAYING.

IT'S IMPORTANT STUFF.

NO, THAT'S FAIR ENOUGH, SIR.

WE'LL ASK HIM TO SPEAK UP.

SORRY ABOUT THAT.

SO WHEN THEY PUT THIS SYSTEM IN, DO THEY DO THIS BEFORE, TAKE MEASUREMENTS AND THEN KNOW WHERE TO SHORE UP OR DO THEY ALREADY HAVE A GOOD IDEA BASED ON THE INSPECTION OF WHAT NEEDS TO BE SHORED UP? SO MY UNDERSTANDING SORRY, THROUGH YOU, MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT BASED ON THEIR VERY PRELIMINARY INSPECTION, THEY KNOW WHERE THE WORST.

AREAS IN THE STRUCTURE ARE THAT ARE WITH THE PRIMARY ASSEMBLIES, WHICH WOULD BE THE MAIN TRUSSES, BUT FRANKLY, THAT DOESN'T SATISFY MY OWN CURIOSITY, AND I MADE THAT CLEAR TO THEM ON SITE DURING THEIR INSPECTION.

BASED ON WHAT WE SAW AND THE SEVERITY OF SOME VERY SELECT AREAS FOR MY OWN COMFORT LEVEL, FOR ME TO MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS TO COUNCIL, I WANT TO SEE ALL NOT ONLY ALL THE PRIMARY COMPONENTS, BUT ALL THE SECONDARY WOOD PURLINS EVERYTHING SO THAT WE KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THE STRUCTURE AS A WHOLE.

SO THE ARENA IS CONSTRUCTED IN SUCH A WAY THAT THE WOOD TRUSSES ARE EXPOSED.

IF YOU'VE EVER BEEN IN THERE, YOU CAN SEE THEM.

THEY'RE WIDE OUT IN THE OPEN, BUT IN BETWEEN THERE'S METAL LINER, PANEL AND INSULATION THAT'S COVERING UP ALL OF THE WOOD MOST PEOPLE WOULD CALL THEM RAFTERS.

THEY'RE ACTUALLY PURLINS THE WOOD THAT CONNECTS THOSE THOSE WOOD TRUSSES, THE LARGE TRUSS MEMBERS.

AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, THOSE ARE JUST AS IMPORTANT AS THE PRIMARY COMPONENTS.

YOU DON'T WANT ANY PART OF A BUILDING TO BE COMPROMISED.

SO REMOVAL OF ALL OF THOSE INTERIOR FINISHES SO THAT WE CAN PROPERLY INSPECT AND LOOK AT EVERY PIECE OF THIS BUILDING TO KNOW THAT IT'S SERVICEABLE AND STRONG ENOUGH, I THINK IS IMPORTANT TO KNOW ALL OF THAT INFORMATION SO THAT WE CAN HAVE AN INFORMED OPINION ON WHETHER THIS IS A RESTORABLE

[00:45:05]

THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU.

WELL, IT'S DIFFICULT TO NAIL ANYBODY DOWN TO ANYTHING AT THIS POINT BECAUSE IN ORDER TO DEFINITIVELY SAY, YES, WE KNOW THIS IS GOOD, YOU HAVE TO SEE ALL THE PARTS, AND SO WE HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO LOOK AT ALL THE PARTS YET.

SO THE REPORT YOU HAVE IN FRONT OF YOU FOR CONSIDERATION TODAY GETS US TO THE POINT WITH ALL THE LOGISTICAL STEPS SO THAT WE CAN SEE EVERY PIECE OF THIS BUILDING STRUCTURALLY TO KNOW THAT IT'S SALVAGEABLE AND SERVICEABLE.

ALL INDICATIONS THUS FAR IS THAT, THAT IS THE CASE.

OKAY. YEAH, LET'S JUST SETTLE THAT FOR A BIT AND I'LL GO TO COUNCILLOR MANN.

THANK YOU, WORSHIP.

I THINK MR. GOULDING'S LAST COMMENT IS, I THINK, THE MOST IMPORTANT.

WE WOULD ESSENTIALLY BE PAYING THE TENDERED PRICE BY THE EXPERT TO GET BACK INTO THE BUILDING WITH NO GUARANTEES WHATSOEVER OF WHAT WE'RE GOING TO FIND OR THE SEVERITY OF IT.

SO REALLY, WE'RE BACK FIVE YEARS.

ARE WE GOING TO FIX THE BUILDING OR NOT? AND WE'RE BACK TO THAT TRUE DISCUSSION.

FIVE YEARS AGO, WE ALL SAT AROUND THIS TABLE AND COUNCIL OF THE DAY DECIDED THAT WE WERE GOING TO EXTEND THE CURRENT LIFE OF THE THEN 51 YEAR OLD BUILDING FIVE YEARS LATER.

WE HAD KNOWN ALL THROUGH THAT TIME THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO GET BACK IN AND DO A REVIEW.

THAT REVIEW HAS BEEN DONE.

SOME WILL ARGUE THAT THE TIMING OF THAT REVIEW WASN'T THE BEST, BUT UNFORTUNATELY IT IS WHAT IT IS, AND I THINK WITH WITH PUBLIC SAFETY AND THE IMPORTANCE OF THE FACILITY, WE'RE HERE TONIGHT.

TO DISCUSS THAT.

CLEARLY, THERE ARE PROPONENTS ON BOTH SIDES, SPEND THE MONEY, GET IT FIXED, GET IN TO SEE WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO.

WE HAVE OTHER PEOPLE SAYING JUST BUILD NEW.

YOU KNOW, REALLY, THE QUESTION THAT I WOULD HAVE IS WHAT IS THE HR CAPACITY OF THIS ORGANIZATION IN ORDER TO DO BOTH AT THE SAME TIME? AND I ALREADY KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT.

TO CREATE A SHOVEL READY PROJECT AND HAVE THAT READY FOR FUNDERS WHO ARE YET TO BE DETERMINED AS WELL AS TO GET A CREW TOGETHER TO MOVE THIS PROJECT FORWARD TO DETERMINE, TO COME BACK IN WHETHER IT'S 30, 60, 90 DAYS AFTER SPENDING $320,000 PLUS A MONTHLY MONITORING FEE, WHAT THAT NUMBER IS GOING TO BE AGAIN, TO REPAIR A 56 YEAR OLD BUILDING WITH OTHER KNOWN POTENTIAL CHALLENGES OF THE PLANT AND THE ICE SURFACE AND EVERYTHING ELSE.

IT'S A VERY, VERY DIFFICULT DECISION, WHICH I DON'T BELIEVE THIS COUNCIL WANTED TO HAVE WITHIN ITS FIRST YEAR TOGETHER.

ONE THING THAT I'M ENCOURAGED ABOUT IS I DON'T BELIEVE, AND I'LL GO ON RECORD BY SAYING THIS I DO NOT BELIEVE THIS COUNCIL IS DIVIDED, WHICH CAUSED US FIVE YEARS OF.

I DON'T GET CRITICIZED FOR THIS.

I'M SURE TOMORROW MORNING BY SOMEBODY, BUT I'LL SAY IT ANYWAY.

THE TURMOIL OF THE LAST COUNCIL AND THE LACK OF TRUE FOCUS ON A PLAN COST US FIVE YEARS.

I DON'T BELIEVE WE HAVE THAT TONIGHT.

WE HAVE A GROUP OF PEOPLE THAT ARE COMMITTED TO THIS COMMUNITY AND ARE PREPARED TO MAKE DECISIONS FOR THE BEST LONG TERM SUCCESS OF THIS COMMUNITY.

I DO NOT WANT TO HEAR OF PEOPLE DECIDING THEY NEED TO LEAVE THIS COMMUNITY BECAUSE WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE AN ARENA.

I THINK WE NEED AN ARENA.

I WANT AN ARENA AND I'D LIKE ACTUALLY A NEW ARENA.

I'VE ALWAYS WANTED MY ARENA DOWN THERE, BUT AGAIN, WE'RE NOT GOING TO GO BACK IN TIME.

I'VE ALREADY LIVED THAT ENOUGH.

SO I JUST PUT THAT OUT THERE FOR THE BALANCE OF COUNCIL BECAUSE I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT.

CAN WE SPEND THE MONEY TONIGHT? DO WE START SHOVEL READY? I KNOW THAT THE MAYOR HAS BEEN IN TOUCH WITH OTHER LEVELS OF GOVERNMENT ALREADY, AND I KNOW THAT DISCUSSIONS ARE TAKING PLACE, BUT AGAIN, WE NEED TO BE ALL ON THE SAME PAGE OF WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO. SO I THINK AT THIS POINT, I'LL STOP AND LET OTHER MEMBERS JUMP IN.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU, COUNCILLOR MANN.

[00:50:02]

THANK YOU. YOUR WORSHIP THROUGH YOU TO MR. GOULDING. A FEW QUESTIONS.

SO THE FACT THAT SOME OF THESE STAGES THEY SAY THE WORDS WITHOUT SNOW LOAD SO WE'RE INTO OCTOBER YOU'VE LIVED IN ELLIOT LAKE.

I MEAN SIX WEEKS FROM NOW THE SNOW COULD BE COMING.

SO MY CONCERN IS YOUR GUYS ARE THERE, THE SNOW IS COMING AND TWO MONTHS, IT'S YOU KNOW HOW CONSTRUCTION IS AND IF IT'S WITHOUT SNOW LOAD, DOES THAT GET ALL CAN YOU EXPLAIN A LITTLE MORE THAN JUST SAYING THOSE WORDS? THANK YOU THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

YEAH. SO SHORT ANSWER IS WE HAVE TO MOVE QUICKLY IN ORDER TO REALIZE THIS AS A PROJECT.

SO RIGHT NOW THE MAJOR LEAD TIME IS ACTUALLY THE DELIVERY OF THE MONITORING DEVICES, AND MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT'S WHY THE THREE WEEK TIME FRAME WAS PROVIDED BY WORD.

THEY'RE PREPARED TO MOBILIZE AFTER THAT BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN THEY CAN GET THE DEVICES IN PLACE, AND THAT IS EXACTLY WHY I ANSWERED COUNCILLOR SEIDEL'S QUESTION ABOUT MOBILIZATION THE WAY I DID, MY INTENTION AND THE WAY THAT I ARTICULATED THE SCOPE OF WORK IN THE REPORT IS THAT WE WOULD DO A PROGRESSIVE CANVASS THEREAFTER.

IF WE GET THESE PEOPLE HERE, WE WANT TO GET THIS DONE.

THE DIFFICULTY IS WE DON'T KNOW WHAT WE DON'T KNOW, AND SO WE I COULD HAVE COMMISSIONED A DESIGN FROM THIS FIRM FOR WINTER SNOW LOAD SHORING STRAIGHT OUT, AND THEIR RECOMMENDATION WAS THAT, NUMBER ONE, SHORING IS NOT AN IDEAL SOLUTION FOR A BUILDING PROJECT.

BECAUSE YOU TAKE IT AWAY ONCE YOU MAKE REPAIRS, AND SO IT'S MONEY THAT YOU SPEND THAT YOU JUST ESSENTIALLY DECOMMISSION AND THROW AWAY.

SO WITH THAT IN MIND, WE'D LIKE TO MINIMIZE THAT, AND ENGINEERS ARE INTERESTING BEASTS BECAUSE YOU CAN ASK THEM FOR THE SOLUTION FOR A GREAT WIDE RANGE OF PROBLEMS AND THEY WILL COME UP WITH ONE.

SO IF WE COMMISSIONED A DESIGN TO PUT WINTER SNOW LOAD SHORING IN PLACE RIGHT NOW, THEY CERTAINLY WOULD DO IT, BUT THEY WOULD OVERENGINEER THAT DESIGN LIKE CRAZY AND THE EXPENSE OF IT WOULD BE SUBSTANTIAL AND PROBABLY TO THE POINT WHERE COUNCIL WOULD LOOK AT THAT AND SAY, WELL, THERE'S NO WAY THAT IS WORTH IT AND THAT WOULD NOT BE REQUIRED.

ALL INDICATIONS ARE RIGHT NOW THAT WOULD NOT BE REQUIRED AT ALL, THE ENGINEER SAID.

I WOULD HAVE TO ASSUME THAT EVERY TRUSS IN THE PLACE WAS NO GOOD AND WE'D HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT IT WAS STANDING THERE WITH THE SUPPORT OF ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE TO GET THROUGH WINTER WHEN IT REALLY WOULDN'T BE REQUIRED EXCEPT FOR IN A FEW SELECT PLACES.

SO IN ORDER TO FIND THOSE FEW SELECT PLACES, WE'RE HAVING A GOOD LOOK, AND WE'VE BEEN COLLABORATING WITH WRD AND OTHER PROFESSIONALS TO TRY AND COME UP WITH A WAY TO GO ABOUT THIS PROJECT SO THAT THE ACTIONS THAT WE TAKE TO MITIGATE ARE NOT WASTED.

SO I JUST DESCRIBED HOW WE'RE TAKING OUT THE MATERIALS FROM THE INTERIOR OF THE BUILDING.

MY FULL INTENTION IS TO DIRECT A DESIGN TEAM GOING FORWARD TO NOT REINSTATE THEM.

I WANT TO BE ABLE TO LOOK AT THE STRUCTURE ALL THE TIME FOREVERMORE, AND SO THAT MEANS WE HAVE TO INSTATE INSTALLATION IN A DIFFERENT WAY, AND SO WE'RE WORKING WITH OTHER COMPANIES TO FIGURE OUT DESIGN PARAMETERS AROUND THAT.

SO THAT CHANGES EVERY PART OF A BUILDING, WORKS TOGETHER WITH EVERY OTHER PART OF THE BUILDING.

SO WE'RE STARTING TO GET INTO A MORE.

NOT NECESSARILY EXPENSIVE COMPLEX BUT BUT EXPENSIVE PROJECT BUT COMPLEX WHICH REQUIRES SOME CONSIDERATION IN ALL THE T EAMS WORKING TOGETHER AND SOME CONSIDERATION OF DESIGN AND COUNCILLOR MANN MADE A REFERENCE TO THE FACT THAT WE'RE RIGHT BACK WHERE WE WERE FIVE, 4 OR 5 YEARS AGO, AND I'D HAVE TO AGREE AND WE'RE IN THAT SAME AWKWARD POSITION WHERE THE CITY IS IN A SITUATION WHERE WE'RE COMMISSIONING A VERY SPECIALIST FIRM TO DO VERY SPECIALIST REPAIRS TO A CUSTOM STRUCTURE, AND THAT'S GREAT.

IT'S ALMOST LIKE MAGIC THAT WE CAN HIRE PEOPLE TO DO THAT AND THEY CAN DO IT EFFECTIVELY.

THE REPAIRS THAT THIS TEAM PUT IN PLACE, YOU KNOW, FOUR YEARS AGO ARE STILL WORKING WELL, IF NOT FOR THE SECOND PART WHERE WELL, THERE'S ACTUALLY A THIRD PART AND WE'LL TABLE THE THIRD PART, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO DISCUSS IT IF YOU GIVE ME SOME ROPE.

[00:55:05]

THIS IS OUTSIDE THE SCOPE OF THIS REPORT, BUT I WOULD NOT ADVOCATE FOR THAT.

AGAIN, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A VERY SPECIFIC THING.

LET'S GET INTO THE BUILDING SO WE CAN LOOK AT IT TONIGHT, BUT THERE'S A COMPONENT TO THIS DISCUSSION THAT I THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE TO ADDRESS NOW, BECAUSE IF WE ALL SIT HERE AND IMAGINE THAT WE'RE GOING TO AFFECT THE MINIMUM AMOUNT OF REPAIRS TO THE STRUCTURE TO GET ON THE ICE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE, I WOULD NEVER RECOMMEND THAT WE DO THAT.

I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE SCREWED UP FIVE YEARS AGO AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE IN THIS UNCOMFORTABLE POSITION RIGHT NOW WHERE WE HAVE A BUILDING THAT WE DON'T TRUST AND WE HAVE PEOPLE SAYING, LET'S, YOU KNOW, INVEST IN A NEW FACILITY WITH A HYPOTHETICAL VALUE.

WHO KNOWS WHAT IT MIGHT BE.

NOTIONALLY, WE'RE THINKING IT'S GOING TO BE IN THE RANGE OF $20 MILLION FOR A NEW FACILITY, AND IT DEPENDS ON HOW WE WANT TO DEFINE WHAT THE PROJECT SCOPE IS, AND WE'VE ALL BEEN DOWN THAT ROAD AS A COMMUNITY BEFORE, YOU KNOW, DOWN TO WHERE DO WE WANT TO PUT IT? WHAT I'M TRYING TO DO IS PUT FORWARD A SOLUTION FOR COUNCIL'S CONSIDERATION WHERE WE GET ON THE ICE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.

IN A FACILITY THAT'S NOT JUST FIXED.

THAT IMPLIES IT'S GOING TO BE THE SAME AS IT WAS BEFORE WE BEFORE IT BROKE.

WE'RE GOING TO PUT A FACILITY BACK THAT IS SERVICEABLE FOR THE LONG TERM, AND WE DON'T HAVE AWKWARD DESIGN PARAMETERS PUT IN PLACE DID EXACTLY WHAT WE TOLD THEM TO DO FIVE YEARS AGO, AND WHAT WE TOLD THEM TO DO IS SPEND THE ABSOLUTE MINIMUM THAT THEY COULD AT THE TIME TO AFFECT REPAIRS SO THAT THERE WAS A FIVE YEAR TIMELINE AT LEAST AND THAT IS A RIDICULOUS REQUEST TO MAKE OF AN ENGINEER, AND IT'S ASTOUNDING THAT THIS FIRM IS CAPABLE OF DOING IT, AND SO THEY PUT DESIGN PARAMETERS ON THE USE OF THE BUILDING, AND ONE OF THOSE IS THAT YOU HAVE TO KEEP THE WATER OUT.

WELL, I WOULD SAY THAT IT'S SAFE TO SAY WE FAILED IN THAT REGARD BECAUSE OF ADMINISTRATIVE STRUCTURE.

WE SHOULD HAVE HAD SOMEBODY PROJECT MANAGING THE WHOLE PROJECT SO THAT THEY WERE ACCOUNTABLE FOR BOTH THE ROOFING MATERIALS AND THE STRUCTURAL REPAIRS, AND SO THAT'S THE KIND OF RECOMMENDATION YOU'LL SEE ME BRINGING FORWARD IN THE FUTURE, BUT MORE THAN THAT.

THEY MADE A DESIGN PARAMETER THAT THE COUNCIL OF THE DAY WAS WILLING TO ACCEPT THAT WE COULD NOT HAVE MORE THAN 30CM OF SNOW ON THE ROOF AT A TIME, AND WE'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT SNOW LOADS HERE, AND SO WE HAVE TO COMMISSION STAFF TO GO AND SHOVEL THE ROOF ON THE ARENA.

EVERY TIME IT SNOWS.

SOMETIMES IT SNOWS MORE THAN 30CM AT A TIME.

IT'S NOT A GREAT SOLUTION, AND WHEN WE GO AND SHOVEL THE SNOW, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT ROOFING PRODUCT YOU PUT UP THERE, IT'S EASY TO COMPROMISE A ROOF WHEN YOU GO AND SHOVEL IT EVERY TIME IT SNOWS.

I DON'T LIKE GETTING ON MY ROOF EVER TO SHOVEL IT.

I DON'T LIKE REPLACING SHINGLES.

SO THE IDEA THAT WE PUT ALL OF THOSE DESIGN PARAMETERS TOGETHER AND THEN ARE DISAPPOINTED AT THIS OUTCOME IS JUST KIND OF IT'S BEWILDERING TO ME AND IT MAKES ME THINK THAT PERHAPS THE COUNCIL OF THE DAY, IF YOU TELL THAT STORY LIKE THAT, I CAN'T IMAGINE SEVEN PEOPLE AGREEING THAT'S A GOOD IDEA.

I DON'T KNOW THAT COUNCIL UNDERSTOOD THAT THOSE IMPLICATIONS FULLY THE LAST TIME THEY MADE THIS DECISION.

OKAY. THANK YOU.

JUST TO FOLLOW UP, SO BASICALLY, THIS IS BASICALLY STEP ONE THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE TO GET TO STEP TWO.

WITHOUT DOING THIS, WE'RE NOT GOING TO KNOW EXACTLY WHERE WE STAND WITH THE ARENA.

THANK YOU. THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

THAT'S EXACTLY THE WAY I SEE IT.

THIS ISN'T SOME MODEL THAT I'M INVENTING.

I HAD THE PLEASURE, I GUESS, OF WORKING IN THE INSURANCE INDUSTRY FOR A CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT OF TIME, AND THERE'S A REASON THAT INSURANCE COMPANIES PROCEED WITH THEIR PROJECTS IN THIS MANNER WHERE THEY HAVE A MITIGATION PHASE.

IF YOU'VE HAD A PROPERTY LOSS IN THE PAST, YOU MIGHT HAVE SEEN INVOICES PROVIDED TO YOU TITLED EMERGENCY AND RESTORATION WHILE AT THE HIGHER LEVELS, WE CALL IT MITIGATION, AND THEN I WORKED AS A CONSULTANT WHERE WE GOT THROUGH THE MITIGATION PHASE, AND THEN I WAS CALLED IN TO MAKE THESE KINDS OF DECISIONS.

DO WE TEAR THIS BUILDING DOWN OR DO WE RESTORE IT? I MADE MY PROFESSION THAT FOR YEARS, AND SO WE CAN'T HAVE AN OPINION ON WHAT WE SHOULD DO TO FIX THIS PLACE OR IF WE SHOULD FIX THIS PLACE

[01:00:06]

ONE MORE QUESTION, THEN I'LL BE QUIET FOR A WHILE.

SO THE CITY WORKERS THAT ARE GOING TO GO IN AND DO THIS, DO YOU HAVE ENOUGH CERTIFIED CITY WORKERS THAT FOR HEIGHT? SO WE'RE WORKING THROUGH THOSE.

SORRY, THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

WE'RE WORKING THROUGH THOSE LOGISTICS NOW, AND THE SHORT ANSWER IS, IF WE DON'T, WE WILL FIND A WAY TO GET THE MATERIALS OUT UNDER CONTRACT WITH ANOTHER PROVIDER, BUT I HAVE THE APPETITE TO DO THIS IN-HOUSE BECAUSE I THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE, AND SIMILAR TO THE TENDER THAT WAS JUST AWARDED TO THE LOCAL ELECTRICAL FIRM.

I THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE A HIGH DEGREE OF COORDINATION BETWEEN THE ENGINEERING FIRM AND CITY STAFF TO MAKE TO REALIZE THIS PROJECT.

SO, SHORT ANSWER IS WE'RE FIGURING THAT OUT.

WE'RE PULLING HR FILES TO SEE WHO'S CERTIFIED.

WE HAVE THREE WEEKS TO GET WORKING AT HEIGHTS CERTIFICATIONS IN PLACE.

WE'RE CALLING AROUND TO FIND PERSONNEL LIFTS AND AVAILABILITY, AND YEAH, WE'RE PLANNING TO MAKE THIS WORK.

OKAY. THANKS.

COUNCILLOR BULL.

THANK YOU. YOUR WORSHIP.

MORE OF A COMMENT. I REMEMBER BACK IN THE BACK IN THE 80S WHEN WE HAD TO SHUT THE ARENA DOWN BECAUSE OF THE SNOW AND THE BEAMS WERE SEPARATING AND THEY HAD TO GO IN AND PUT THOSE STEEL PLATES THAT YOU PROBABLY ALL SEEN THAT JOIN THE ROOFS.

SO IT JUST BOGGLES MY MIND THAT WAS IN THE EARLY 80S OR THEREABOUTS, AND HERE WE ARE 40 YEARS LATER, STILL DEALING WITH THE SAME BUILDING WITH SOME OF THE SIMILAR ISSUES, AND I THINK WE HAVE TO GO FORWARD.

WE HAVE TO FIND OUT WHAT'S WRONG WITH THIS BUILDING.

SEE IF IT'S WORTH FIXING FOR ANOTHER FIVE, TEN YEARS, WHATEVER.

NOWADAYS, TECHNOLOGY MIGHT GIVE US A LOT MORE THAN FIVE YEARS ONCE WE FIX IT UP.

SO I'M FOR THAT AND I JUST WANT TO GET THIS GOING, BUT I THINK OR I KNOW THIS WON'T WE WON'T PUT THE ICE BACK IN THIS YEAR, THAT'S FOR SURE. OR NEXT SPRING, I WOULD IMAGINE.

SO WE'D PROBABLY BE LOOKING AT NEXT YEAR DEPENDING ON HOW MUCH WORK HAS TO BE PUT INTO IT.

GO AHEAD. WELL, THIS IS THERE WASN'T A QUESTION THERE.

SO IF I WAS WISE, I PROBABLY WOULDN'T COMMENT, BUT THERE'S THINGS THAT SOUNDED LIKE QUESTIONS THERE, AND I'M SURE THERE'S QUESTIONS THAT PEOPLE HAVE INTERLACED WITH ALL OF THAT. I'LL GO IN ORDER.

SO I REMEMBER YOU MENTIONED THAT YOU REMEMBER REPAIRS BEING PUT INTO PLACE IN THE 80S AND WE THEY'RE STILL THERE.

WE CAN SEE THEM. THE WOOD EXPERTS NOTED THEM AND COMMENTED TO ME DURING THEIR INSPECTION THAT THEY SEE THAT KIND OF MITIGATION PUT IN PLACE QUITE OFTEN AND THAT IT'S REALLY NOT EFFECTIVE.

SO. THAT'S WHY I WANT TO SEE A FULSOME INSPECTION BY PEOPLE MORE QUALIFIED THAN PUT THOSE DESIGNS.

MAYBE THAT WAS LIMITATIONS FROM THE ERA.

WHO KNOWS? I WON'T CHARACTERIZE OTHER PEOPLE'S DECISIONS WITHOUT UNDERSTANDING THEM, BUT THERE'S BETTER WAYS TO DO THOSE REPAIRS THAT WE CAN WITNESS, AND YEAH, THE OTHER POINT IS THAT BUILDING CODES CHANGE OVER TIME AND SNOW LOAD WASN'T CHISELED INTO STONE EONS AGO.

PEOPLE HAVE DIFFERENT OPINIONS OF WHAT APPROPRIATE SNOW LOADS ARE NOW THAN THEY DID IN 1967 WHEN THIS PLACE WAS FIRST CONSTRUCTED, AND WHAT YOU'LL BE SEEING COME FORWARD FROM ME IS A RECOMMENDATION TO PUT A STRUCTURE IN PLACE THAT WILL WITHSTAND MODERN CODES.

LIKE I HAVE NO APPETITE TO SEND WORKERS UP TO SHOVEL SNOW OFF THE ROOF.

IT'S A LIFE SAFETY ISSUE.

IT'S A BUILDING MAINTENANCE ISSUE.

I DON'T WANT TO BE DOING THIS IN FIVE YEARS.

SO IF THAT'S THE SOLUTION THAT SEEMS FEASIBLE FOR THIS BUILDING, THEN IT WILL CHANGE MY OPINION ON WHAT'S FEASIBLE FOR THIS BUILDING, BUT I DON'T ANTICIPATE THAT'S THE CASE RIGHT NOW, AND YOUR LAST COMMENT WAS WITH RESPECT TO TIMING, AND I THINK IT'S FAIR TO SAY THAT WE'RE IN FOR A PROJECT. WE DON'T KNOW WHAT WE DON'T KNOW RIGHT NOW, BUT MY GOAL IS THAT WE ACT WITH ENOUGH CONSIDERATION AND QUICKLY ENOUGH AND IN A COORDINATED WAY THAT WE CAN BE SALVAGING SOMEWHAT OF A SEASON NEXT YEAR, AND I DON'T KNOW ANY OTHER WAY TO DO THAT.

IF WE'RE TALKING NEW BUILD, THEN I WOULD SAY THAT'S OFF THE TABLE.

[01:05:02]

MY GUT FEELING SAYS SCRAP THE BUILDING.

LET'S GO AND TRY TO GET A NEW ONE.

I DO UNDERSTAND THAT IF WE DO ALL OF THIS WORK, WE'LL HAVE A BETTER IDEA OF WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

SO MAYBE IT IS A GOOD IDEA TO DO THIS, BUT IF WE'RE GOING TO SPEND THIS AMOUNT OF MONEY AND SHORE THE BUILDING AND ALL THAT, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE CERTAIN ITEMS REMOVED FROM THE ARENAS IN CASE THERE IS GOING TO BE A COLLAPSE, MEANING THE ZAMBONI, IF WE COULD STORE THAT SOMEWHERE ELSE AND BIG PIECE OF EQUIPMENT THAT ARE WORTH A LOT OF DOLLARS UNTIL WE KNOW FOR SURE WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

DO I WANT TO SPEND $400,000 NOW AND SPEND ANOTHER $2,000 AND COME BACK IN FIVE YEARS FROM NOW TO THE SAME RESULT? NO, I'M LIKE YOU.

I WANT THIS TO FIGURE IT OUT NOW AND DO IT PROPERLY.

NO MORE FARTING AROUND.

EXCUSE THE WORDING.

I THINK WE NEED TO MOVE ON ON THIS AND MAKE A PROPER DECISION FOR THE PEOPLE OF ELLIOT LAKE.

THEY'VE WAITED LONG ENOUGH FOR THIS ARENA, AND WE NEED TO MOVE ON.

THERE'S FAMILIES OUT THERE THAT NEEDS IT.

THANK YOU.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? COUNCILLOR FLINTOFF.

THANK YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

JUST A COMMENT SORT OF FEEL LIKE WE'RE CAUGHT BETWEEN A ROCK AND A HARD SPOT HERE.

BEST CASE SCENARIO, LET'S BUILD A NEW ARENA.

EVERYTHING CLICKS.

SEND OFF, GET THE GOVERNMENT INVOLVED.

THREE, FOUR YEARS FROM NOW.

WE CAN'T WAIT 3 OR 4 YEARS BEFORE OUR KIDS ARE SKATING AGAIN.

IT'S UNHEARD OF.

SO WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH THE CARDS THAT WE HAVE IN FRONT OF US.

THAT'S HOW I FEEL AND DO EVERYTHING WE CAN TO GET TO GET OUR ARENA BACK OPEN, AND THEN.

WE LOOK AT THE ARENA, BUT I JUST CAN'T THINK OF NOT JUST FAMILIES, ADULTS, PEOPLE, THE WHOLE RECREATION. WE NEED AN ARENA, AND FOR ME, MYSELF PERSONALLY, IT LOOKED GREAT TO TURN A KEY, BUT 3 OR 4 YEARS.

BEST CASE SCENARIO, WE CAN'T WAIT THAT LONG, AND I DON'T THINK ANYBODY WANTS TO WAIT THAT LONG.

I REALIZE WE HAVE A LOT OF OTHER INFRASTRUCTURE ISSUES, BUT THIS IS A FAIRLY MAJOR ONE THAT WE HAVE TO.

WE HAVE TO; THAT'S WHY, AS COUNCILLOR MANN SAID, WE'RE FAIRLY ALL ON THE SAME PAGE MOST OF THE TIME.

WE DON'T ALWAYS WANT TO BE ON THE SAME PAGE ALL THE TIME, BUT I THINK TOGETHER WE CAN GET THROUGH THIS AND LET'S FIGURE OUT WHAT WE HAVE.

THAT'S IT. COUNCILLOR MORRISSETTE.

I THINK SINCE WE'RE GOING TO BE DOING THAT THROUGH THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP AND THIS INVESTIGATION, I WOULD LIKE ALSO THAT THE STAFF LOOKS OR CONTINUE TO LOOK AT A NEW BUILD MAYBE OR MORE INFORMATION OR KEEP TALKING TO THE GOVERNMENTS AND SEE IF THEY'RE WILLING TO COME TO THE TABLE.

MR. GOULDING FIRST, AND THEN I'LL COME BACK.

YEAH, THROUGH YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

YOU'LL BE HAPPY TO KNOW, COUNCILLOR MORRISSETTE THAT WE'RE ALREADY DOING THAT KIND OF PRELIMINARY RESEARCH TO TRY AND GATHER AS MUCH INFORMATION AS WE CAN.

MY HOPE IS THAT AFTER THIS MITIGATION PHASE AND WHATEVER FURTHER WORK MAY BE REQUIRED AFTER STEP FIVE, ONCE WE HAVE ALL THAT INFORMATION IS IN PLACE SO THAT WE HAVE A STABLE BUILDING AND WE CAN MAKE GOOD DECISIONS, WE WILL BE ARMED WITH ENOUGH INFORMATION SO THAT WE CAN MAKE THAT INFORMED DECISION ON RESTORING THIS FACILITY OR REBUILDING A NEW ONE, AND HOW WE'D LIKE TO PROCEED? BUT I THINK THAT WE NEED TO HAVE AN IDEA OF SCALE IN ORDER TO THINK ABOUT THIS APPROPRIATELY.

IF WE ACCEPT THE FIGURE THAT IT'S ABOUT A $20 MILLION INVESTMENT FOR A NEW ARENA, WHICH WILL CONFIRM, WE'RE HOPING TO HAVE THAT INFORMATION SOMETHING

[01:10:07]

THAT KIND OF INVESTMENT IS IT EXCEEDS ALL OF OUR AVAILABLE RESERVES RIGHT NOW.

WE WOULD BE BORROWING TO DO SO, AND WE HAVE A LIST OF CAPITAL PROJECTS THAT WE WILL HAVE TO BORROW TO REALIZE THAT INVOLVE PROVIDING THINGS LIKE ROADS AND WATER TO THE CONSTITUENTS OF THIS COMMUNITY, AND SO IF WE EXHAUST ALL OF OUR AVAILABLE BORROWING CAPACITY OR EVEN A GOOD PORTION OF IT, WE NEED TO FIGURE ALL THAT OUT BEFORE WE MAKE THOSE KINDS OF DECISIONS ON AN ARENA WE'RE MAKING NEW PROBLEMS FOR OURSELVES WITH OTHER.

NECESSARY AMENITIES TO THIS TOWN.

SO IF WE POSITION OURSELVES SO THAT WE'RE WAITING FOR FUNDING I MEAN, I DON'T WANT TO MISCHARACTERIZE THIS BECAUSE IT'S NOT QUITE LIKE THIS, BUT IT'S PRETTY CLOSE TO THIS.

IT'S NOT A LOTTERY TICKET.

IT MIGHT BE A 50/50 DRAW, RIGHT? LIKE THAT'S WHAT GOING TO GET FUNDING SUPPORT IS LIKE, AND ONE OF MY CATCHPHRASES AROUND THE OFFICE IS THAT HOPE IS NOT A STRATEGY.

RIGHT. SO THERE'S A STRATEGY THAT WE CAN PUT IN PLACE HERE SO THAT WE'RE WELL POSITIONED TO BE PATIENT TO REALIZE A BIGGER THING LATER IN A WAY THAT WE CAN AFFORD, BUT IF WE EXTEND OURSELVES NOW AND THROW AWAY AN OPPORTUNITY TO GIVE US SOMETHING STABLE IN ORDER FOR THE HOPE THAT WE CAN HAVE SOMETHING MORE LATER, THIS COMMUNITY WILL BE WITHOUT A FACILITY FOR AN EXTENDED PERIOD OF TIME IS MY THOUGHTS. THAT'S I'M PAID TO GIVE YOU THE BEST RECOMMENDATIONS I CAN, AND THAT'S HOW I SEE THE CARDS AS THEY'RE DEALT.

OKAY. THANK YOU, MR. GOULDING. COUNCILLOR SEIDEL.

THANK YOU, YOUR WORSHIP.

I WAS GOING TO SAY SOMETHING, BUT YOU BASICALLY SAID EXACTLY WHAT I WAS GOING TO SAY.

SO, YOU KNOW, IF WE HAVE TO MOVE FORWARD NOW SO WE CAN HAVE AN ARENA WITHIN THE NEXT YEAR, 15 MONTHS. I AM COMMITTED TO A NEW BUILD AS WELL, WHICH I BELIEVE 90% OF US HERE ARE ALL 100% OF US HERE.

I CAN'T SPEAK FOR US ALL, BUT WE NEED TO HAVE AN ARENA WITHIN THE NEXT 15 MONTHS AND NOT FIVE YEARS DOWN THE ROAD, AND I THINK THE ONLY WAY WE CAN ACCOMPLISH THAT IS BY MOVING FORWARD WITH THIS.

YOU KNOW, I KNOW IT'S AN EXUBERANT AMOUNT OF MONEY, $300,000, BUT I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANY WAY WE CAN DO IT.

IF WE DO NOT DO THIS.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

COUNCILLOR SEIDEL.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? FOR MYSELF, THIS KIND OF ISSUE IS A PARALLEL TO WHAT I DO EVERY DAY.

I ASK PEOPLE TO SPEND MONEY TO FIND OUT INFORMATION SO I CAN MAKE THE BEST DECISION POSSIBLE.

IT JUST HAPPENS TO BE FOR YOUR PET, BUT THIS IS JUST THE SAME.

I DON'T WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION TO MAKE A DECISION ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.

YOU BOIL IT DOWN.

YES, THE OPTIONS ARE DETONATE AND START A NEW ONE.

OR, AS MR. GOULDING SAYS, FIGURE IT OUT AND MITIGATE.

WE CAN'T PREDICT THE FUTURE.

WE CAN'T GUESS WITH THIS, AND WE HAVE TO BE VERY SAFE AND CONCERNED ABOUT NOT ONLY THE COMMUNITY, BUT NOW GOING FORWARD, THE PEOPLE THAT WILL BE WORKING IN THERE.

I JUST REALLY THINK IT'S PRUDENT THAT WE HAVE TO TAKE THESE STEPS.

COULD YOU IMAGINE IF WE CAN SAVE THIS BUILDING AND THAT WE DIDN'T DO THIS? AND CAN YOU IMAGINE IF WE COULD SAVE THIS BUILDING AND SPEND THE MINIMUM AMOUNT OF MONEY JUST TO GET IT FOR ANOTHER FIVE YEARS? BUT WHAT IF WE COULD DOUBLE THAT AMOUNT OF MONEY AND WE GET 15 YEARS? THE COMMITMENT FOR A NEW ARENA IS DEFINITELY WITH ALL OF US KNOWING WHAT WE KNOW NOW WITH OUR FINANCES, OUR BUDGETS, OUR PROJECTS THAT WE THINK ARE COMING UP.

IT'S AN AWFUL LOT OF MONEY.

WE CAN'T DEPEND ON GRANTS, LOANS THAT ARE COULD BE PIXIE DUST FOR ALL WE KNOW.

[01:15:07]

THERE'S NO WAY THAT ANY OF THEM WILL CONFIRM FUNDING FOR ANYTHING, JUST THAT IT'S OUT THERE AND THERE'S A POTENTIAL.

YOU LOOK BACK HISTORICALLY, THIS PLAN WAS BASICALLY, YEAH, WE ARE REPEATING GROUNDHOG DAY FIVE YEARS AGO.

THERE ARE ISSUES WITH JUST SAYING LET'S BUILD A NEW ARENA.

IT'S CLEAR THAT THE LAST COUNCIL WERE PLANNING FOR THAT AND IN FIVE YEARS IT STILL COULD NOT COME TO FRUITION, AND THAT MAY NOT EVEN HAPPEN WITH US EITHER. A 15 YEAR PLAN FOR THAT.

MAYBE IT'S POSSIBLE.

MAYBE WE START SAVING NOW, BUT AGAIN, THIS ENTITY OF A COUNCIL TURNS OVER.

SO IN FOUR YEARS THERE COULD BE A DIFFERENT DECISION MAKING PROCESS.

I MEAN, I THINK OUR GOAL IS TO SET IT UP, THAT OUR FUTURE IS NAILED DOWN, BUT WE CAN'T JUST SAY NEW ARENA NOW AND NOTHING FOR FOUR YEARS TO SPEND THE MONEY ON THE TESTING I THINK IS PRUDENT.

I SAID THAT TWICE NOW.

COULD IT BE A WASTE OF MONEY? WHO KNOWS, BUT IT COULD ALSO SAVE EVERYTHING.

SO MY FEELING IS THAT.

WE SHOULD GO THROUGH WITH THIS.

GET IT MONITORED, GET IT SHORED UP SO IT'S AT LEAST SOMEWHAT SAFE SO WE CAN FULLY INVESTIGATE WHAT'S HAPPENING.

WE COULD BE BACK HERE IN THREE MONTHS SAYING, OKAY, WE'RE GOOD OR WELL, WE HAVE SOME HOPE.

SO LET'S JUST HOPE, AND IT'S GOING TO COST MONEY TO DO THE TESTS, AND THAT'S JUST THE WAY OF THE WORLD.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS? ARE WE PREPARED TO DO A VOTE? OKAY. ALL IN FAVOR.

NONE ARE OPPOSED, AND THAT'S CARRIED.

SO THERE ARE NO NOTICES OF MOTION, NO CLOSED SESSION BUSINESS.

WE'RE JUST GOING TO TAKE SOME TIME.

COUNCILLOR MANN WOULD LIKE TO HAVE AN ANNOUNCEMENT, PLEASE.

YEAH. THANK YOU, BISHOP. I JUST WANTED TO ADVISE FOR THOSE THAT WEREN'T AWARE WE LOST ANOTHER LONG STANDING MEMBER OF THE MUNICIPAL COUNCIL OVER THE WEEKEND.

ROSARIO CAPPILLO PASSED AWAY ON SATURDAY, SEPTEMBER 30TH, AND AGAIN, I THINK MR. CAPPILLO SERVED EARLY 70S AND FOR A LARGE TIME PERIOD THROUGH THE 90S ON THE ON OUR COUNCIL.

ROSARIO WAS VERY PASSIONATE ABOUT THE AIRPORT.

I CAN REMEMBER THAT FONDLY ENSURING THAT WE CONTINUE TO HAVE THAT AND I JUST WANTED TO BRING IT FORWARD TONIGHT AND RECOGNIZE HIS PASSING AS A LONG STANDING MUNICIPAL COUNCILLOR IN THE COMMUNITY.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU, COUNCILLOR MANN.

[9.1 By-Law 23-90]

9.1 BYLAW 23-90 BEING A BYLAW TO AUTHORIZE AN AGREEMENT WITH 1000062562858. ONTARIO LIMITED ACTING AS WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING WITH THE RESPECT TO PROJECT NUMBER RDS2023-08 BEING GRANULAR A AND B GRAVEL.

MAY I HAVE A MOTION THAT BYLAW 23-90 BE PASSED? MOVER COUNCILLOR SEIDEL SECONDED COUNCILLOR MANN.

ALL IN FAVOR? NONE OPPOSED. THAT'S CARRIED.

[9.2 By-Law 23-91 ]

ONTARIO LIMITED OPERATING AS WENDELL FARQUHAR TRUCKING WITH THE RESPECT TO PROJECT NUMBER RDS2023-12 BEING WINTER SAND. MAY I HAVE A MOTION THAT BYLAW 23-91 BE PASSED? MOVER COUNCILLOR FLINTOFF SECONDED COUNCILLOR SEIDEL.

ALL IN FAVOR? NONE OPPOSED. THAT IS CARRIED.

[9.3 By-Law 23-92]

MAY I HAVE A MOTION THAT BYLAW 23-92 BE PASSED?

[01:20:02]

NONE ARE OPPOSED. THAT'S CARRIED.

[10.1 By-Law 23-93]

10.1 BYLAW 23-93 BEING A BYLAW TO CONFIRM THE PROCEEDINGS OF COUNCIL AT ITS SPECIAL MEETING HELD ON TUESDAY, OCTOBER 3RD, 2023. WE HAVE A MOTION THAT BYLAW 23-93 BE PASSED.

MOVER COUNCILLOR MANN SECONDED COUNCILLOR BULL.

ALL IN FAVOR? CARRIED.

ADJOURNMENT. MAY I HAVE A MOTION THAT THIS MEETING ADJOURNED AT THE HOUR OF 8:20 P.M..

MOVER COUNCILLOR FLINTOFF SECONDED COUNCILLOR SEIDEL.

ALL IN FAVOR? NONE ARE OPPOSED.

THAT'S CARRIED.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH, EVERYONE.

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.